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 Post Posted: Tue Jan 20, 2015 7:01 pm 
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Hi

I have had some Homegroup issues before and recently set up a new User account, I have found some problems, and thing I have resolved them, but wanted your thoughts.

Basically, Wife has laptop and I have pc, we were a Homegroup and could see each other's files most of the time. We also have relatives over who of course ask for a WiFI connection for iphones etc, so we give them router password, and then I assume they are on our Network while they are here. So here are my issues.

1/ Sometimes my wife and I could see each others folders, even though both computers were on, bOth said Joined, and when I ran Homework Troubleshooter, it couldn't find a problem. How did we solve - I don't know - a few days later the Homegroup would be working again. We have had this more than once. Not sure anyone can help since it is working now.

2. I recently got more security conscious and set up a separate user account on my pc. So I have H1 (the original) and H2(new). Since all was shared from H1, when I was on H2 I could see the H1 folders. Since I didn't set up any to share on H2, I didn't see any of those on H1.
The other day I was on her laptop and could see H1 on Homegroups, and not H2. But then I clicked on Networks, and saw all the H2 Files. This was a shocker! Any ideas what might have been going on?

At this time, I can't tell you what I had on, since I turned off everthing to make sure I didn't share something I wanted on all the Networks.

3. I set up Homegroup again on my PC, and joined H2. But again while it said joined for both H1 and H2, I couldn't see any files! Like the problem in 1 above.
So I then Joined wife's pc. Now all see seem joined correctly, I don't seem to see H2 files on either computer under Homegroup or Network. Not sure if there is any other way to check if H2 ight be visible to them.

4. I notice that neither my pc or her laptop shows our Iphones are connected to the network tho we both have WIFI to the router. Nor our Android tablets. shouldn't they be shown as being on the Network?. Frankly I am too new to both devices to tell if I can see H1 or H2 info on either device? Or if some of our more techsavvy relatives might see it when they connect to WIFI.

thanks for any and all help, M


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 Post Posted: Tue Jan 20, 2015 8:20 pm 
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I'll leave most of your questions to others with more network experience but allowing access to your Wi-Fi to visitors does not in any way add them to your network of systems. It only allows them access to your Wi-Fi. It is no different than going to McDonald's and connecting to their Wi-Fi. In such a case no visitor can see any of your files nor can you see theirs.

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 Post Posted: Tue Jan 20, 2015 10:21 pm 
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I'll answer #4 first. You will not see your other devices on your Windows PC network map. They are not part of your network, they are simply connecting via WiFi to your router and to the Internet. They do not connect to your computers or each other.

As for your issues with being able to see shared resources between the accounts/devices that are joined to the Homegroup, the sporadic nature suggests that the issue could be network connectivity related. If the PCs are connecting via WiFi, an occasional drop can cause the Homegroup to not be able to refresh.

In the Homegroup, setting up sharing is considerably easier, but it isn't perfect. Each of the PCs are members and the user account folders on the PCs are potentially shared with the homegroup. However, the way this works is that one PC is the "master" of the homegroup and the other PC joins. If you log into the PC with User #1 and that PC becomes the "master" the other PC joins to it. If you log out or turn off the PC which was the master, there is no master until the other PC advertises that it will take that role. When you turn the old master back on, it has to rejoin the homegroup or take over as master. As you can imagine, there's lots of negotiation going on and sometimes it can be flakey.

-steve

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 Post Posted: Sat Feb 07, 2015 1:19 pm 
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athanks for the help

one more related issue. I thought I had solved the problem but recently noted while in one user account I could use the search files and programs in the start area to find files in the other user account. I haven't shared any files from the latter one - I wanted it off limits. When I called Microsoft the guy says this is supposed to be that way on Windows 7. Seems crazy - makes user accounts rather worthless doesn't it? He says even a gues account can search other user accounts!


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 Post Posted: Sat Feb 07, 2015 3:46 pm 
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If the User is part of the homegroup, the default is sharing with the homegroup. You can change this from that user's account by right clicking on the User's folder and select Share With and selecting Nobody.

-steve

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 Post Posted: Sat Feb 07, 2015 9:35 pm 
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I checked that - the user has Nobody re sharing files, and you cant see that user's files thru Homgroup. Similary I turned off Network Discovery, so you cnat there that way.

Yet, I can access the files in the other account and for that matter edit them in two different ways.
Under the start Icon on lower left youcan search for anything and pull it up.
Secondly, when I go to open My pictures, the various Icons on the left side include Homegroup,l Network and Computer and Libraries and Faviorties. Nothing shows up under Network or Homegroup, but when u click Computer the drives show up, and if u click on them, u get access to whatever u want. THus each user can access everything !
thanks


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 Post Posted: Sat Feb 07, 2015 11:26 pm 
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If you are using an Administrator account for the PC you have access to all files on the PC. You have rights to add/delete Users.
-steve

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 Post Posted: Sun Feb 08, 2015 4:03 pm 
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It is a standard account that I am in and I can search nd find info in the administrator account!

It seems that the standard account mechanisms lock you out of the Cdrive for other users, but not the Edrive. I had to go into the edrive under properties and security settings to disable access to the edrive for other users. It took quite awhite to figure out, and to disable inherited properties etc. in any case, the file now has a little padlock icon on it, and is not visible to other users , at least that I can figure out . It seems fine to work with so far.


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 Post Posted: Sun Feb 08, 2015 9:28 pm 
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Are the files on the E drive simply folders and files created and/or stored by the other user? Then this behavior is normal. The restricted folders would be located under \Users\ -- wherever that is. The default location for the \Users\%username% folders would be C:\, but this can be changed. If any user on the PC creates a folder on a secondary drive such as E:\ it is available to anyone with access the PC unless you explicitly secure the folder. The same holds true for any folder outside of the \Users\ folder branch, including external drives.

-steve

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 Post Posted: Mon Feb 09, 2015 1:27 pm 
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THanks - quite a mystery! Seems to make sense. I am surprised that that this is the default - I would have thought all user info on any drive is secure from other users unless you do something different.
I gather the little padlock key is the sign it is secured.


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 Post Posted: Sun Feb 15, 2015 3:17 pm 
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Hi

Still trying things out, like Veracryptor. A bit confused how it interacts with user accounts
I created a volume and mounted on my non-existent F drive, then uploaded to cloud, then realized the guest account could see teh F Drive.
So I went in and changed permissions for the entire F Drive - one account has full access, and guest access specifically deniyed evertything.

yet the guest account can still access F Drive under My Computer.

the other account is still logged in, but I suppose if it logs out, no one can see F Drive. But is there a way to keep guest users from seeing if other one is logged in. I did that with E Drive, but not working with the ficticious F Drive.

thanks


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 Post Posted: Sun Feb 15, 2015 11:54 pm 
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What does this mean? "I created a volume and mounted on my non-existent F drive"
And "access" for the guest means? I assume that the guest account can see the drive and perhaps list files and folders. Can they read a file from F:\? can they write a file to F:\?

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 Post Posted: Mon Feb 16, 2015 5:12 am 
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What does this mean? "I created a volume and mounted on my non-existent F drive"

Well, that is a good question, they are terms used by Veracrypt to describe teh crypted file (volume) and where you load it on your computer. As best as I understand, I don't have a real F drive, but Veracryp somehow "mounts" it on this F Drive, or any other letter drive. Can't propvide more, since I have no clue what it is all about.

F Drive - the gues user can open the document and work on it! Just like posts above when I noted this was the case with the E Drive, and you said that was typical unless you change the permissions. (I also noted that seemed bizarre to me, why wyould one user be able to see another one's storage as a default!)_. But even when I change defaults on the F drive, I can't stop Guest user from seeing the F Drive.


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 Post Posted: Mon Feb 16, 2015 7:32 am 
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Ah, I understand now. You have created a Virtual drive using 3rd party software.
That adds a layer of complication to your situation. That Virtual drive may not behave the same as a real drive in Windows, though it appears to. The Guest account should not have those rights on a file or folder unless the Guest is part of a Group with those rights. I trust that you didn't modify rights on the Guest account or User Groups, but worked on permissions for the files/folders?
For the folder/folders that you wish to restrict, see if the following helps:
http://www.sevenforums.com/tutorials/12 ... roups.html

-steve

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 Post Posted: Tue Feb 17, 2015 3:08 pm 
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Thanks Stephen,

I will check out the post you referenced, probably good for me to know. I am guessing it won't work with a virtual file, since I had specifically provided taht teh Guest user was denied access to the F Drive. In any case, I posted on the veracrypt site, andd there is a button there that dismounts when you change users if you want, rather than just log off. Will see if the post above allows you to stay mounted and still keep others form seeing it.


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 Post Posted: Thu Feb 19, 2015 1:03 am 
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I am no doubt in way over my head, with Veracrypt, clouds and permissions. But let me aski one more from teh site yo suggested - I had a bunch of inherited permissions and deleted them so I could deny the other users access. i see i also deleted SYSTEMS, and Adminsitrators and Authenticad Users. I guess I should put Systems back in.

As to veracrypt, thre is a setting there to dismount the virtual drive after a certain time, or loggin goff, or shitching users. It seems best to me to try to just use those rather than create permissions on teh virtual drive. Since youdismount anyway, I suspect I would need to recreate teh permissions everytime I created the new drive.


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 Post Posted: Thu Feb 19, 2015 7:15 am 
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Administrators and Authenticated Users are Groups. SYSTEM is a special permissions account for the operating system. I don't believe that you have the ability to simply create a SYSTEM user. I do hope that you are not testing permissions on a PC that you can't afford to fresh install Windows on. :-)

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 Post Posted: Fri Feb 20, 2015 4:59 pm 
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By "afford" do you mean $, like buying Windows 8

actually I think I am done with Windows permissions for now. I think things are working as I want them to, tho only time will tell. In any case, I think I have everything backed up in other user names, and I can delete the problem user if need be. If not, well then if I have problems I know to blame myself!


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 Post Posted: Fri Feb 20, 2015 9:29 pm 
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No, afford meaning to need to wipe the PC and lose everything due to not having a good backup and reinstalling any version of Windows. When permissions are messed up at the system level, repairing them is next to impossible. Your User account permissions and settings aren't the issue, but the SYSTEM account could be. I messed up the permissions for several of the built-in accounts on a Windows 8 machine. Despite my best efforts at repair, the only valid solution in the end was a complete wipe and reinstall of Windows.

-steve

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