Jay, I ordered an exact replacement.....1 TB Samsung. I will give the partitioning some thought.

I do have a related question. Although I have replaced and added hard drives, these have never been the boot drive. So before I install Win 10 for my friend, how do I check to make sure that the newly installed boot drive is working properly?

If I start the computer and then press F2 to go to the BIOS Setup, will I get some kind of indication that the new drive is recognized and valid? If so, what kind of indication and where should I look for it?

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BB
http://barrypatch.net

Just boot to the Windows 10 install media and do any partitioning through that interface. If the new drive is defective it will fail on the install. Since there is no reason to suspect that the new drive will be bad just install Windows.

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I don't partition any more, if the drive is going to fail it doesn't matter if there are multiple partitions. Especially now, with drives that are non-spinning the failure rate is much lower.

I normally don't either except for the dual boot on my laptop. Still, in a case of a single drive, I would think it easier as to backups with the system and data separate.

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I also see no good reason to partition on a single drive system any longer. Backups of data would simply point to the \User folder(s). On my desktop with 2 internal drives, I still keep most of the data (quantity, not size) in my User folder on the system SSD and use the other hard drive for downloads, music, and video.

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stephen boots
Microsoft MVP 2004 - 2020
"Life's always an adventure with computers!"

I'm clearly a dinosaur when it comes to isolating data from the OS, i won't have any data that i care about on the same partition as the OS.

I've been burnt too many times by Windows becoming corrupted to know that keeping data within the the OS directory is almost always going to end in tears, eventually.

Backups are only useful from the moment they were made, re-installing Windows (or using a backup) is normally a painful and reasonably quick process, recovering data on the other hand when it's stored in a corrupted Windows directory without being backed up, is not.

Just my tuppenceworth.

I guess that I'm also a dinosaur on this but I think my reasons may be a bit different.

My main system does not use partitions between system and data but, rather, separate physical drives. My system drive has 342 GB used space (a fair number of games installed) and my data drive has 435 GB used space for a total of 777 GB used space. If all on one drive/partition this would dramatically increase the time to make a clone or image backup; 342 GB versus 777 GB to backup. I know that I could do incremental images instead of always full images but I just, personally, don't like the idea of incremental and the clone time would still be increased a lot. Actually I DO have one partitioned drive in my main and second systems. In both cases it is a 2 TB spin drive partitioned in half for data and internal images.

As to my data I sync between two systems and, now and then, backup to an external drive using a simple drag and drop. I don't seem to acquire data as fast as I used to do which means that combining system and data in a clone or image is kind of a waste of time. Having separate system and data drives isn't really different than partitioning one drive to act as two.

Bottom line is that this is one of those cases where there probably isn't a true best answer. It boils down to what works best for the individual.

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Heh, for what it's worth, I keep everything together but have copies of that "everything" all over the place using different hard drives (internal and external) and different backup/recovery programs. I simply use a Word doc to keep track of everything so I don't get confused and to let me know which backup to recover from if needed, yesterday or many weeks ago, and I always make extra, separate backups of my docs so I can recover the current docs if I need to go back weeks in time for the entire system.
Bill

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The blazing evidence of immortality is our dissatisfaction with any other solution. -- Emerson

I do exactly what Bill (and Steve) do. I keep everything together on my SSD but have backups all over the place using different internal & external drives and different automated backup programs (Macium, Acronis & Windows). As for my data, in addition to the full backups just mentioned, I use SyncToy, File History, and a USB flash drive. As soon as any data file (e.g., Excel spreadsheet, Word document) changes, I immediately save it on the flash drive, and later it will be saved via SyncToy, File History & backups.

Also like Bill mentioned, I keep a Word document denoting what I save, when and where. I also use Sticky Notes to remind me what my backup strategy is for each of my computers. Using the above strategies, I have never lost a data file over the years.

But like Jay sorta said......different strokes for different folks.

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BB
http://barrypatch.net

I use multiple drives, but they are all single partition.

On this laptop I have an 128 GB SSD drive and a 1tb hard drive, I have it set so that the OS and Office plus security are on the SSD which is C: and everything else gets sent to the hard drive which is D: and set as the data drive. I do full image backups to 2 external portable hard drives.

My desktop has a 2tb hard drive split into C: and D: but that was already done at the manufacturer Acer. I do full image backups to an external hard drive that is permanently connected to the tower via USB and mains power.

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Joan Archer
http://crossstitcher.webs.com

This isn't a dinosaur, i can't help think though that if Jay were a dinosaur on a mission to sniff out a poorly configered PC, this is what he would look like!:

https://youtu.be/2uy8i1nM3aE

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There is no joy in Mudville tonight. I received the new hard drive for my friend's computer and hooked up the power and SATA cables. Then I started the computer and immediately received this message: "Notice: Hard Drive Self Monitoring System has reported that a parameter has exceeded it's normal operating range. Dell recommends that you backup your data regularly. Press F2 to continue."

I pressed F2 and verified that the HDD was the first boot drive, followed by the DVD drive. Then I exited BIOS and pressed F1 to reboot. That's when I got the same old message: No boot device available.

At that point I cranked up my primary computer and hooked the new drive into my Sabrent docking station....but the docking drive never appeared. I then went to the Sabrent website and found out that a brand new drive must first be initialized to cause the drive letter to appear.

Is that correct? Must I sprinkle some fairy dust on a brand new drive to get it operable?

And what are the chances of the new drive also being bad?

Any suggestions on where I should go from here would be appreciated.

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BB
http://barrypatch.net

You need to boot with an installation disk and reinstall Windows, that will make the new drive bootable.

Are you powering up the PC with a Windows Install DVD in the DVD drive?

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stephen boots
Microsoft MVP 2004 - 2020
"Life's always an adventure with computers!"

You MUST select the Windows install media as the boot device whether you do it through the BIOS boot order or selecting the F-# key to select the boot device.

Once the above is done you will be led through the install process. Since I believe that this system was running Windows 10 it should automatically activate once the system is on-line. You do NOT want to initialize the drive through your external dock as there is no reason to do so. When you select the drive as the Windows install drive all that will be done automatically assuming that the drive is connected to the problem PC.

Getting a bit ahead of us here. Make sure that you have ALL system drivers downloaded and saved for the system especially the drivers for the network adapter, chip-set and video. Others drivers such as audio can be installed later. Network drivers are probably the most important as they are needed to connect to the Internet to allow you you to download other device drivers.

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Yes, I used a Windows 10 install disk in the DVD drive, but it was not recognized even though I made the DVD drive the first boot device in the BIOS boot order. When I started up the computer, I almost immediately got the "no boot device available" message.

At that point, I decided to remove the new drive from the computer and see what would happen if I inserted it into the docking station while the dock was attached to my primary computer. I was merely trying to see if the new drive had any life at all. But since the dock drive was not even recognized, that's when I went to the Sabrent website and read that I must first initialize the hard drive by making it a New Simple Volume via Disk Management.

Now, I assume that I'm using the correct Windows install disk. Last month when my sister gave me her old Win 7 computer, I downloaded a Win 10 (version 2004) ISO and burned a DVD. I then used that DVD to successfully install Win 10 on my sister's computer. That is the same DVD that I used today in an attempt to install Win 10 on the new hard drive. I figured if that DVD worked once, it should work again. Right?

I'm becoming more convinced that my friend's computer has other problems than a hard drive, so she may end up needing to buy a new computer. But before she does that and before I return the new hard drive to Amazon, I would like to at least see if it works. If it is a workable drive, then I may keep it and install it as a 2nd drive in the computer that my sister gave me.

Thanks in advance for any continuing advice..........

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BB
http://barrypatch.net

First, for what you want, quit using the new docking bay to connect the new system drive. Connect the new drive to the SATA power and data cables on the problem system and boot to the install media for Windows 10.

Please explain EXACTLY how you are trying to boot to the Windows install media. Please remember that you can't just burn an install Windows ISO file to disk and have it work. You MUST right click on the ISO file and select to burn the image. This will result in a bootable install media.

If you have already done all the above and it still fails then the mother board is possibly toast.

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Jay, I know I need help, but I'm not really a dufus.

If you read my above post, you will see that: (1) I used the docking station ONLY after the new drive wouldn't boot. And I did this only as a means of trying to verify that the new drive was good. And BTW, I only purchased the docking station because you recommended that I get one. (2) I had already successfully used the windows install DVD to install Windows on my sister's computer, so I assumed it would work a second time. And you previously taught me about right-clicking on the ISO file to burn the image.

So yes, as I stated in my above post, I had already done everything you mentioned. So I am indeed beginning to think that the motherboard (or something thereon) is toast. But as a secondary objective, I am trying to ascertain the goodness of the new hard drive so I can decide whether to return it to Amazon or keep it and use elsewhere. And I figured the drive dock you recommended might be an easy way of doing that. I guess another way would be to install the new drive in my sister's computer and see if it's recognized and usable.

So today, on the chance that I did something wrong, I am going to repeat every thing I did yesterday after the new drive arrived. I don't know what else to do.......

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BB
http://barrypatch.net

Hey, go to Device Manager and make sure the drive is initialized.

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Go to Device Manager where? I can't get to it on my friend's failed computer. I can't get to it using my docking station. I probably could get to Device Manager if I installed the new drive in my sister's working computer.

Is that what you are suggesting I should do? And how would I then know that the drive is initialized....because Device Manager recognizes it? Or should I first initialize the drive via Disk Management>New Simple Volume as the Sabrent website recommended?

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BB
http://barrypatch.net

Sorry, I typed Device Manager when I meant Disk Management...

Try going to Disk Management with the drive in the dock. If it is good it should show as a removable drive. If it is not initialized you should get an alert saying that a drive needs to be initialized. Just allow it to do it.

If the drive needs to be formatted 'New Simple Volume' should be fine.

As to the install media failing on the failed system it kind of points toward the possibility of the mother board. Do you have any other boot media you could try? Might also try different SATA ports...

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Problem(s) finally solved.....new hard drive is installed and running Windows 10 Home (version 2004). Now I need to populate it with all her programs and data.

Turns out the last issue was a malfunctioning DVD drive tray. When I went to remove the DVD install media that I had been trying to use, the door wouldn't open. So I had to use the old 'paper clip in the hole trick' to get the door open and the tray out. That sorta told me that the DVD disk had not seated properly in the tray. So I carefully inserted the DVD again, and low and behold Windows 10 started to install.

I did encounter one problem during the install....I couldn't connect to the internet. The system kept looking for an Ethernet connection, since that is what my friend uses in her house. I disabled the Ethernet but I couldn't get the system to recognize my wifi connection even though the computer has an internal wifi adapter. I'll work on that issue after my nap.

Thanks to everyone for their help and advice. My friend's problem was indeed a failed hard drive.

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BB
http://barrypatch.net

A couple of thoughts:

a. The DVD may be fine but the DVD drive in your friends PC may be faulty, have you tried to run the Win10 DVD in your own DVD Drive?
i.e. Using your own PC see if the disk will boot and initialise the Setup process, needless to say make sure you have a backup of your own PC before you try this, if it boots from the disk on your PC then cancel the Setup process before any changes are made.

b. If the disk works in your DVD Drive then the issue is almost certainly her DVD Drive has failed.

c. <delete> Just saw your latest post that you worked it out.